Empress Flame Alternative Look

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Hydra Mirage
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Post by Hydra Mirage » Mon Nov 01, 2004 8:01 pm

more to the point, how are MH's manufactured !
It would seem forging a sword is a simple process compared to creating an MH.
I've often wondered why there are no utility MH's.

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Mave
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Post by Mave » Mon Nov 01, 2004 8:40 pm

hitori wrote:
Mave wrote:Aah but I meant that just like Fatima meights, Sword smiths (or sword meights? :P ) may massproduce swords at factories and they may dispose of personal "factorylabs" that produce single masterpieces.
Well then...:roll:
The problem still remains.
If a master swordmeight personally design and makes a sword from a facility that has such capabilites, would that make the product a non-masterpiece? I dont think so.
I hope you are not really entertaining the thought that swordmeights hammer out their swords with regular tools and traditonal techniques :roll:

I'm sticking to my theory of CAD and computer-assisted design and manufacture (at Joker level of tech of course) unless Nagano says otherwise :P

Tomexe

Post by Tomexe » Mon Nov 01, 2004 11:37 pm

Hydra Mirage wrote:more to the point, how are MH's manufactured !
It would seem forging a sword is a simple process compared to creating an MH.
I've often wondered why there are no utility MH's.
There are "utility" MH's of sorts, though MH's are so expensive things like tanks and fighters are still used for most utility work.

But the AKD Blood Temple is their "Utility" MH, the basic green Berlin is actually a "Utility" MH. The Devonshire is a "Utility" MH for several countries. The Basic models of Siren (the ones with low letters like A-E, since the F is known as a special lightweight and we have seen that the high letters like V, Q, R are produced only in twos and threes) are Filmores utility MH. There is probably a basic model of A-Toll too.

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Mave
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Post by Mave » Tue Nov 02, 2004 12:08 am

When Hydra Mirage mentioned "utility" MH:s I think he meant MH used for things such as construction. Just as the labors in Patlabor.

The problem with the MH as a workermachine is that countries probably wont spend those big bucks on a MH with such a limited and unglamorous role. From the first pages of the manga whenever we see MH:s they have been there for one reason only and that is combat,war,destruction and to some degree showoff. That doesnt mean that they cant be "misused" for such unwanted duties such as plowing fields though :P

I think the situation becomes clearer when you read the passages in the emperor rescue mission between a tank commander and his driver. They mention electronic countermeasures and targeting in relation to fatimas. Obviously the fatima can put up an ECM-field ordinary weaponry such as tanks and jets cant hope to penetrate. The driver then asked why they cant have a fatima in the tank. The obvious answer is that such high price commodities doesnt get wasted on some obscure tank battalion but are reserved for the weapon that overpowers traditional forces, the MH.

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Hydra Mirage
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Post by Hydra Mirage » Tue Nov 02, 2004 1:08 am

I would imagine machines like the Aliens Powerlifter would be useful in MH manufacture.
Or maybe something that looks like an LED without the armour (and Mirage engine !)

Just noticed in Knight Flags, the Empress Flame is labelled
MH The Empress/Goat Mirage MIRAGE Ausf X
http://www.toyspress.co.jp/BOOK/nightfl ... fla01.html

But the chronology in the English translation states
JC 6800 Amaterasu builds MH Goat Mirage, also know as Magdall Chivalries....Hmmmm
Last edited by Hydra Mirage on Wed Nov 03, 2004 3:31 am, edited 2 times in total.

Lalasa

Post by Lalasa » Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:36 am

Whoops...wrong thread. This was supposed to go into the B4 one...

S *runs away*

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Post by Hydra Mirage » Sat Nov 06, 2004 6:45 am

Here is a link to a scratch kit of the Goat Mirage,

http://www.marina.ne.jp/~hermann/empress.htm

Lalasa

Post by Lalasa » Fri Nov 12, 2004 12:07 am

The Empress Flame is the machine, right? The Empress of Flame is a...humanoid being, right? Is the Empress Flame modeled after the Empress of Flame? Or they have absolutely nothing to do with each other? Who is the Empress of Flame? Would that be Nein or...? And what in the world, or out of it in this case, is the Empress of Flame? Is she a god?

S

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Post by Nu Soard Graphite » Fri Nov 12, 2004 12:30 am

Lalasa wrote:The Empress Flame is the machine, right?
Yes.

The Empress of Flame is a...humanoid being, right?
Yes.
Is the Empress Flame modeled after the Empress of Flame?
Yes. The headress of the MH Empress is very similar to the headress to the Empress of Flame. She can be seen in Japanese volume 9 or English volume 22 (page 75)

Or they have absolutely nothing to do with each other?
Nope. Its quite obvious once you see the Empress of Flame that she inspired the design of the MH Empress.
Who is the Empress of Flame?
The supreme ruler and spiritual leader of the Farus Die Kanon super empire during the AD era of Joker.
Would that be Nein or...?
Umm...no...I don't think so. In Japanese Volume 9 (English 21) they seem to be different entities, however Nein may be a projection of the Empress of Flame, much like Mel Rince is a projection of Amaterasu. Don't quote me on this though, I don't know for certain.
And what in the world, or out of it in this case, is the Empress of Flame? Is she a god?

S
I don't think so. She is a very powerful Diver from the Super Empire. Super Empire knights and divers were far more powerful than their J.C. equivalents. The pure Headdliner and Diver genes have been diluted by normal human genes when they mixed with the normal populace after the fall of the Super Empire. Thats why "Pure Blood" Knights and Divers are so much more powerful than their standard counterparts.
It may be that she was deified after her death (if she is dead) but I don't know anything about this as it does not mention this in any of the translated sources I posses.
Shinei!

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Post by sarion » Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:02 am

and also Sakurako as Meight? her full name?....

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Post by Rubel Colus » Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:25 am

**** Contains spoilers ****

Nein is indeed the Empress of Flame. She just dresses differently when she appears as Nein.

The Empress of Flame is the Nineth Empress of the Super Empire, thus she is called Nine or Nein. The Super Empire is at its greatest peak during her era, and she is the most powerful diver in all of Joker history. She left for Stant during the AD5000s era and came back during AD8383. She and her people have transferred their minds into crystals and became semi-permanent to prolong their existences.

The Nein that we see fighting alongside with Ned during AD8383 was an alias created by the Empress.


**** End Spoilers ****

Creating an alias is the highest ability of Highbrain, which is a lost form of one of the four schools of diver powers. There seems to be some limitations when creating an alias:

1. The diver who created an alias will be immobilized as all his/her mental focus is directed to the alias.
2. The alias is a 'copy' of the caster, i.e. they will definitely look the same.

Divers with Highbrain powers who are able to create an alias: Beauty Peel, Nein.

Amaterasu should not be confused with normal divers. He is a god of light - all his powers are coming from divine sources. When he creates his aliases such as Rince or Agari, he's not doing it like the divers. Thus, he can move freely when his aliases are active. Also, his aliases look different from him. Amaterasu pretends to create his aliases like a normal diver.
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Post by Rubel Colus » Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:30 am

sarion wrote:and also Sakurako as Meight? her full name?....
Natrium Xing Sakurako
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Post by Nu Soard Graphite » Fri Nov 12, 2004 1:44 am

Rubel Colus wrote:**** Contains spoilers ****

Nein is indeed the Empress of Flame. She just dresses differently when she appears as Nein.


Thought so! I just didn't want to say myself because I wasn't 100% certain (like that's ever stopped me before... :roll: )

Creating an alias is the highest ability of Highbrain, which is a lost form of one of the four schools of diver powers.
Eventually someone will, so I'll ask it now:

What are the four forms of Diver power?
Shinei!

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Post by Rubel Colus » Fri Nov 12, 2004 2:09 am

Nu Soard Graphite wrote: Eventually someone will, so I'll ask it now:

What are the four forms of Diver power?
I'm not sure if the English versions use the same wordings but here goes:

1. Diver power - offensive powers, e.g. Tin
2. Para Simul - spiritual and predictive powers, e.g Atoll Empresses like Mugumika
3. Highbrain - mind control, used to control knights during AD era. The highest levels of Highbrain are able to create an alias
4. Alchemy - creation powers. Fatima & MH meights are actually a subset of this.

When we talk about 'diver', it is a very general term used to describe any of the four powers. The first two kinds are the common forms during the JC era. Highbrain and Alchemy are supposed to be "lost" during JC era. However, Beauty has very great Highbrain powers, which is extremely rare.

Very rarely, there will be divers with two forms of powers, e.g. Mikoto with Para Simul and Diver Powers. Of course, Vos, Magdall, and Empress of Flame have all four types of powers - they are what we call Diver Force.

I am wondering where does the power of teleportation belong to? :?:
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Post by Hydra Mirage » Fri Nov 12, 2004 3:39 am

what episode does Mel Rinse appear in ?

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