Aug 18 Update

Post by **Tachyon** » Thu Aug 18, 2005 10:54 pm

Added Sarion, Schaft and Paison to the character pages today.

Please give them a look and let me know if there are any errors or anything missing.

Thank you, Nu Soard, for those 3 profiles.

hitori · Post by **hitori** » Thu Aug 18, 2005 11:27 pm

Looks good.

About Paison's name, do you suppose that Nagano meant 'Python'?
Since many GL Mirages have English nicknames I thought that might be what it's supposed to be.
Just a guess

Post by **Tachyon** » Thu Aug 18, 2005 11:28 pm

You may be right. I'd never thought of that but it certainly makes sense. What do you think, Nu Soard?

Falk · Post by **Falk** » Thu Aug 18, 2005 11:45 pm

Or maybe 'poison' ?

Thanks for the profiles, I had never seen that first artwork of Shaft.

About Sarion, did he killed his family mmh... for no reason ? I thought there was another story behind this (the crashed car, maybe something about Aisha's family), maybe you didn't wrote it to avoid spoilers ?
I just want to be sure, I wouldn't want to make my own stories and think it was really in the manga until it's finally in english

Rubel Colus · Post by **Rubel Colus** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 4:03 am

Some points to discuss:

- After the 1st coup, was Sarion "officially" executed or did he "officially" died of illness (according to Genealogical Table)?

- Sarion has gotten his nickname of "LED" even before 2997 since during the 2nd coup, Kaien called him by his nick.

Nu Soard Graphite · Post by **Nu Soard Graphite** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 4:35 pm

Rubel Colus wrote:Some points to discuss:

- After the 1st coup, was Sarion "officially" executed or did he "officially" died of illness (according to Genealogical Table)?

I have a translation of Sarion's profile from Twin Towers provided by Mr Wisnom (thanks John!). Here's what it says on that issue:

Twin Towers wrote:

It was in 2955 that at the tender age of eight-years Sarion decided that he would not assume Amaterasu sovereignty and abandoned his right to be emperor. The history books say that he died during the negotiations. Ask any school kid in Grees.

I also remember from "back in the day" on Wax Trax reading that he was executed for killing his family. Maybe the excuse was that he suddenly died of illness and they locked him up in Hell Tower.

- Sarion has gotten his nickname of "LED" even before 2997 since during the 2nd coup, Kaien called him by his nick.

I know. Kaien mentions to Lachesis how he was surprised she could perform a Mirror, thinking that only LED (meaning Sarion) and himself could do that.

Nu Soard Graphite · Post by **Nu Soard Graphite** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 4:38 pm

Tachyon wrote:You may be right. I'd never thought of that but it certainly makes sense. What do you think, Nu Soard?

The first translation I saw of Eidrian Tag's nickname was "Python"

However, in the english version, the Katakana is tranlated literally into Paison. Kept to avoid confusion with new readers.

I've also seen "Poison" used for his nickname as well.

Nu Soard Graphite · Post by **Nu Soard Graphite** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 4:54 pm

Falk wrote:.

About Sarion, did he killed his family mmh... for no reason ? I thought there was another story behind this (the crashed car, maybe something about Aisha's family), maybe you didn't wrote it to avoid spoilers ?
I just want to be sure, I wouldn't want to make my own stories and think it was really in the manga until it's finally in english

It is unclear why Sarion killed his family (at least to me). Nagano may have written why somewhere, but its not in Twin Towers, which is where I got my profile on Sarion from (or to be more accurate, where John Wisnom got it from...I got his translation to work from)

However, what I have heard before (which I chalk down to "Rumor and Speculation" until I have more concrete confirmation) is that Sarion killed his family because they were planning a revolt against Amaterasu.

Kinda weird, huh?

He kills his family because they were going to attempt a Coup d'tate, then a few years later, he does so himself!

Well, I'm thinking his motivation behind his rebellion was that he wanted Lachesis out of the way. Since the power-seals on Hell Tower had been released, Sarion probably assumed that Amaterasu was dead (which he was, technically) and he didn't want the throne of Grees to fall into the hands of a Fatima. Thus the Coup.

Makes perfect sense to me!

Rubel Colus · Post by **Rubel Colus** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 6:14 pm

Nu Soard Graphite wrote:
- Sarion has gotten his nickname of "LED" even before 2997 since during the 2nd coup, Kaien called him by his nick.
I know. Kaien mentions to Lachesis how he was surprised she could perform a Mirror, thinking that only LED (meaning Sarion) and himself could do that.

But when i read from the profile, it seems to say that Ikaruga got his nickname around 3159? When in fact he had it as early as 2997. (EDIT: zzz should be 2992.... >_<" )

As for the official reason for Sarion's death, other sources (Chronicle 2005) also state "died of illness". I guess it could be that he died of illness during negotiations.

Post by **Tachyon** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 7:15 pm

Quick Note:

Nu Soard has asked me to change the info on Sarion/Ikaruga's nickname. I will make the change to Sarion's profile soon to reflect the information given by Rubel Colus. Thanks, Rubel.

I am willing to adjust the info on Sarion's official, stated cause of death once we can work out what the best answer would be. All character profiles can and will be adjusted once better information is learned.

Rubel Colus · Post by **Rubel Colus** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 8:00 pm

*** Spoilers *** Spoilers ***

Why did Sarion kill his parents and wiped out his entire family?

The answer was finally revealed in the latest NT issues which will be part of JP Book 12 (not yet published). I've added in alot of my own thoughts/comments, so....

What does Throne succession mean?

Throne succession is not merely the sequence for candidates to become the next Emperor of Grees, it is also a representation of how much political power the faction holds. In the case of the 84th, Amaterasu's closest royal families are firstly the Shinate (Sarion's) and then the Codante (Aisha's). The main Amaterasu family will of course get top priority to throne succession, that is, if Amat has a descendent. Next will be Shinate then Codante. Sarion originally had 2nd place succession. So in this sense, the Codante were behind the Shinate.

What was the reason behind the "accident"/assassination?

Aisha's parents (then head of Codante) had a newborn, Wascha, late in their years. (Maybe coz Aisha made it clear that she's not gonna have any children. Wascha is much younger than Aisha). The parents of Sarion, fearing that they might lose the power struggle and also trying to weaken the Codante, attempted to assassinate Wascha, but Wascha survived and only the parents were killed. Amat seemed to know who were the masterminds. The citizens began to lose faith and confidence in the Emperor and his kingdom. Sarion, worrying that the matter will worsen, approached the Emperor many times, but still Amat refused to do anything.

Sarion's First "coup".

So Sarion finally took it upon himself to lead the Left Mirages and wiped out his own family for his loyalty to Amat. The truth may be that Amat expected Sarion will do it... Notice that nobody ever wanted to assasinate the Emperor himself, is it becoz they were:
- still loyal to the Amaterasu sovereignty?
- aware and afraid of Amat's power?
- only wanted to vie for more power under Amat's rule?

After the coup and Sarion's "death", House Shinate was no more. Naturally, Sarion lost his right to succession.

As for the 2nd "coup" @ JC2992, Laki is not only unrelated by blood , but also a fatima. I guess Sarion couldn't let the throne be controlled by someone unrelated and a fatima at that.

JC3010, a new House Emite was announced to the public, Prince Ikaruga (Sarion) is head of the House, and he gets 5th in succession.

Post by **Tachyon** » Fri Aug 19, 2005 9:03 pm

Thanks for the information!