Star Wars episode III hater's note

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Star Wars episode III hater's note

Post by 2000YearsOldMan » Thu Jun 02, 2005 6:06 pm

Hey, everybody check out this.
A friend of my, sent me this link it is very some thing.
http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net ... u=episode3
PS. Star Wars fan please don't read this.
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Post by Falk » Thu Jun 02, 2005 6:13 pm

HAHAHA !
Great ! I had lost that link^^

Many of those articles are hilarious, though sometimes he goes a bit far (the one about Christopher Reeves for instance, unless I didn't got a certain degree of humor).

I'm gonna read this rightaway :twisted:
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Post by Altron » Thu Jun 02, 2005 8:07 pm

Hilarious, even though I'm a Star Wars fan. He makes a very good point.

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Post by Nu Soard Graphite » Thu Jun 02, 2005 9:24 pm

Haha...

Yeah, he has some good points, but its obvious that he doesn't like any of the Star Wars movies, because at the end he says that all the SW movies suck.....which just ain't true (well, it is a matter of opinion, but popular opinion does hold some weight)
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Post by kosh » Fri Jun 03, 2005 3:19 am

Being less than a fan of SW I have to say that's hilarious . I'm not as rabid about it as he seems to be , but he does have some good observations regarding SW . BTW , does the new SW end the way he said it does ? If it does , the only thing I can say is lame .
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Post by Tachyon » Fri Jun 03, 2005 3:53 am

I just came back from seeing the movie. I really enjoyed the 3 classic movies but I'm not a big fan of the prequels. I don't want to spoil anyone's fun but since we're all sharing our opinions I'll share mine.

The storyline and acting didn't excite me. I think Anakin was poorly cast. Surely they could have found someone better than this guy!

As for Maddox' beefs with Episode III, he has a lot to say but with some of his points I disagree:

Maddox makes the point that it can't be a children's movie as it has "hands chopped off, a graphic decapitation, the wanton slaughter of children" and "legs chopped off as his stumps catch fire while his face melts." In the film, when limbs get cut off there's no blood and the camera doesn't linger on the injury. No guts spill out or are even seen. To me the decapitations aren't very graphic at all. The slaughter of children isn't shown. We see a light saber flicker to life and then the scene cuts away. In later scenes we hear people talking about the slaughter of children. Young children watching this movie have a very good chance of not realizing that any children died. As for Anakin's sufferings, again, I didn't think they were very graphic. I saw his body on fire but no flesh melted or even charred. There was some soot on his face but that isn't a big deal. My point is, by today's standards this wasn't a very violent movie and certainly not graphic. As a father of a 2 year old and another due in one month I can't see this movie giving children nightmares. (No, I didn't take my son to this movie but only because I knew he couldn't sit still for 2 hours.)

Maddox speaks of the Sith as if they're a race but I'm pretty sure it's a club rather than a race. He also says the Sith are know for "KILLING MILLIONS OF PEOPLE" but I don't think this is true. The Sith are largely unknown by residents of the Republic. I got the sense that Anakin knew so little about the Sith that he decided to make up his mind about them when he learned more.

The scene where Anakin chokes Padme with his dark side powers isn't a masterpiece of filmmaking but I disagree with Maddox' assertion that it destroys the plot (now, don't misunderstand me here, I didn't think the plot was that great). Anakin wasn't really intent on killing Padme. He was just lashing out without really thinking things through. I got the feeling that even if Obi Wan hadn't been there Anakin wouldn't have killed her. Drawing from my own experience, I love my wife and her cooking but once I got so angry at her that I dumped a full plate of food into the trash just to upset her. It was a childish and stupid thing to do (especially since it smelled so good) but we don't always think clearly.

Finally, the point that Episode III had no special effects because they were used so much as to render them no longer special relies too much on his own interpretation of "special effects." My understanding is that special effects is a term to describe visual elements of the film that were added after filming the scene with the real live actors. If every scene has special effects the term "special effects" is still used.
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Post by Daishikaze » Fri Jun 03, 2005 1:35 pm

I agree with Maddox, Though I feel he worded things incorrectly, he is right for the most part. To be honest after seeing this I remembered alot of plot holes from the second film.

Like Jango Fett working for the droid army, even though he was the template for the clones. That is just too much of a coincidence, yeah he's a merc, but what are the odds that this guy would also be in the employ of your enemy when he just allowed himself to be cloned to make your own army? something about that doesn't sit right with me.

Also, They find out that camino has been making their clones for over 10 years, They have no records of even asking them to do it, and the "jedi" who asked Camino to do it died mysteriously 10 years ago as well. Worse yet, is no one seems to remember the guy either. And the fact that someone was hiding Camino from the Jedi, should have clued them in that something was up.

Someone was engineering this war 10 years ago, and not one person was suspicious enough to say "Hang on, something ain't right here, Lets think this through thoroughly".

No, someone said, "hey, we got a clone army, and these other dudes are building a droid army, Lets use these clones that we know nothing about and fight them"

Honestly, the only surprising thing in the whole trilogy was when Yoda was kicking Dooku's ass.



And Anakin is a moron, because he should have remembered Dooku's fate. Dooku was an upstanding member of the Jedi once, and he got swayed by Palpatine, who knows that Paplpatine promised him, but look what it got him, death. And his own master told Anakin to do it too, isn't that a clue that this guy is trying to manipulate you? That he doesn't care what happens to you as long as he gets away clean.

I find it difficult to believe that the Jedi don't tell their students about the Sith, Telling them what the Sith did in the past is not teaching them how to become one. I think Anakin was sleeping in class the days they went over that in Jedi history class.

Oh, and this is quite amusing too:

http://www.vgcats.com/comics/images/050531.jpg
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Post by KOG » Fri Jun 03, 2005 4:26 pm

Daishikaze wrote:Like Jango Fett working for the droid army, even though he was the template for the clones. That is just too much of a coincidence, yeah he's a merc, but what are the odds that this guy would also be in the employ of your enemy when he just allowed himself to be cloned to make your own army? something about that doesn't sit right with me.
He wasn't working for two sides. He was working for 2 aspects of the same side. Palpatine set up the seperatist movement to present a cause for the deployment of the Clone Troopers. Who he would eventually use to cement his power. So Jango was not working at cross-purposes, he was always working for Palpatine's side, whether he was providing the genetic make-up for Palpatine's clone army, or supporting the seperatists.

And Anakin is a moron, because he should have remembered Dooku's fate. Dooku was an upstanding member of the Jedi once, and he got swayed by Palpatine, who knows that Paplpatine promised him, but look what it got him, death. And his own master told Anakin to do it too, isn't that a clue that this guy is trying to manipulate you? That he doesn't care what happens to you as long as he gets away clean.
Anakin may have been short-sighted enough to not realize that Dooku had been Palpatine's old apprentice. He certainly didn't know it when Palpatine told him to execute Dooku, because he didn't yet know that Palpatine was a Sith Lord at that time. Maybe he should have put 2 and 2 together later, and realized the Dooku had been the apprentice, but then again, he might have thought they were unrelated Sith. And even if he did realize what role Dooku had played before, he was probably self-centered and emotional enough to rationalize the whole thing as 'hey, it won't happen to me, I'm stronger than Dooku, I can take care of myself'. With Anakin's personality, that line of thinking is actually quite likely.

I find it difficult to believe that the Jedi don't tell their students about the Sith, Telling them what the Sith did in the past is not teaching them how to become one. I think Anakin was sleeping in class the days they went over that in Jedi history class.
I think that in ep I-III, the Sith hadn't been seen around for a long, lone time. So maybe, if they didn't teach young Jedi about them, it's because they didn't want to temp anyone into studying more about the Sith, and possibly follow the Dark Side teachings out of curiosity. Obviously this wasn't the best plan of action... Also, one could consider that the Jedi Masters might have considered 'Dark Jedi' to be a stain on the reputation of the Jedi, and if the Sith hadn't been seen in a long time, they might have wanted to sweep the Sith 'under the rug' so to speak.


Well, don't get me wrong, I had problems with Ep I-III. But they mostly have to do with over-use of CGI effects when standard effects techniques might have worked better, some poor acting (especially in ep I and II), and JAR JAR. As for plot stuff, I didn't really bother to search for minute plot-holes.. and I think most of them can be explained away anyway. I enjoyed ep III for the most part... I thought Obi-Wan's anguish about what he had to do to Anakin had some much-needed emotional impact. My biggest problem with ep III in particular was actually the musical score. The final Anakin vs Obi-Wan fight should have been accompanied by some really stirring, emotional, forceful music... and instead it had some rather bland and repetitive generic star wars action music. Blah.

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Post by Daishikaze » Fri Jun 03, 2005 5:51 pm

He wasn't working for two sides. He was working for 2 aspects of the same side. Palpatine set up the seperatist movement to present a cause for the deployment of the Clone Troopers. Who he would eventually use to cement his power. So Jango was not working at cross-purposes, he was always working for Palpatine's side, whether he was providing the genetic make-up for Palpatine's clone army, or supporting the seperatists.
What I mean is, his presence should have tipped them off really. Combine that with what I said earlier, and they should have easily put the pieces together. It was obvious something was up, but they chose to rush in all guns blazing instead of thinking things over thoroughly.
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Post by KOG » Fri Jun 03, 2005 6:16 pm

Daishikaze wrote: What I mean is, his presence should have tipped them off really. Combine that with what I said earlier, and they should have easily put the pieces together. It was obvious something was up, but they chose to rush in all guns blazing instead of thinking things over thoroughly.
My memory of ep II is hazy, but...

Wasn't Obi-Wan the only one who new Jango was the basis for the Clones? I don't remember him ever informing the Jedi of Jango's name or appearance.

And at the end of ep II in the arena, Obi-Wan was down on the arena floor while Jango was way up in the stands with the seperatists.

The other Jedi who saw Jango fighting for the seperatists wouldn't have known who Jango was, and they wouldn't have known that he had been working with the cloners.

Jango didn't come down to the arena level until later, and by that time the battle was on, so I doubt there was much opportunity for Obi-Wan to spot him AND see who he was fighting for AND inform the other Jedi of the possible connection.

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Post by Falk » Fri Jun 03, 2005 9:58 pm

Some plot holes that bother me are :
-the one depicted in the first drawing on this website. The strongest point of dark force is in front of them all the time and they don't feel anything at all. When we see how Anakin turns into the dark side quickly and can't control himself, it's strange to think Palpatine has been hiding his true self since "quite some time" without getting mad, moreover when we see how crazy he is when he can finally reveal himself.
-the line about Luke and Leila's mother in episode 6. Leila says she was beautiful but sad, but in episode 3 Amidala dies, so the person Leila talks about is her adoptive mother. Sure it works, but the way the word "sad" is used emphasises the fact we think she's talking about her true mother, right ? Well I mean, saying she's sad about her adoptive mother doesn't make much sens, or if anything could explain this sadness, well it's not explained at all. Don't know, maybe they bought a new spaceship, and have a hard time to pay their credit back... :wink:

And I don't really like how he doesn't bother thinking about something coherent to place an action scene. At the beginning, in the space fight scene, they break the spaceship window, and 5 seconds later it's already part of history, as if nothing happened, then they land a half space ship that just passed through atmosphere, with no wings nor thruster to pilote it, and they land right on the landing zone... :roll:
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Post by KOG » Fri Jun 03, 2005 10:05 pm

Hm I think the 'beautiful, but sad' part IS talking about Padme. Not the adoptive mother.

Isn't it 100% possible that Leia saw IMAGES of her mother? Either still images, or those 3d moving holo-images. If Padme had been in any images during the Ep III time period, she surely would have looked beautiful but sad.

Remember, just because Padme died when Leia was born, doesn't mean it was impossible for Leia to see what Padme looked like. :P

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Post by Nu Soard Graphite » Fri Jun 03, 2005 11:19 pm

Falk wrote:Some plot holes that bother me are :
-the one depicted in the first drawing on this website. The strongest point of dark force is in front of them all the time and they don't feel anything at all. When we see how Anakin turns into the dark side quickly and can't control himself, it's strange to think Palpatine has been hiding his true self since "quite some time" without getting mad, moreover when we see how crazy he is when he can finally reveal himself.
There is an explaination for this, but it is not well known. It was made known in some background information after Episode 1 was released (I think it may have been in the visual dictionary or something like that).

Basically, the Sith were at one time nearly as plentiful as the Jedi and they battled one another constantly. Unfortunately for the Sith, since they were all evil, they battled amongst themselves as often as they battled the Jedi and this was their undoing. One powerful Sith Lord named Darth Bane finaly emerged victorious amongst the Sith, executed all the other Sith lords except one which he made his apprentice, then he set down the one unbreakable Sith law that there should only ever be two Sith. One Master and one Apprentice. And so it has been for several millenia since the Sith war.
During these many millenia, the hidden Sith perfected the art of hiding and stealth, that one day they may roam freely amongst the Jedi that they may destroy them from within. Palpatine is the culmination of that training. The reason the Jedi can't sense him is because he has specifically trained for this purpose and has thousands of years of Sith teachings to this effect to draw upon. Sith are the ultimate masters of deciet, misdirection and illusion. There were probably several Sith lords amongst the Jedi, sowing the seeds of their final destruction for centuries. Palpatine was merely in a position to take advantage of their weaknesses and strike the final blow. Anakin provided that opportunity...
-the line about Luke and Leila's mother in episode 6. Leila says she was beautiful but sad, but in episode 3 Amidala dies, so the person Leila talks about is her adoptive mother. Sure it works, but the way the word "sad" is used emphasises the fact we think she's talking about her true mother, right ? Well I mean, saying she's sad about her adoptive mother doesn't make much sens, or if anything could explain this sadness, well it's not explained at all. Don't know, maybe they bought a new spaceship, and have a hard time to pay their credit back... :wink:
I assume she was talking about her real mother (Padme) as well.

I think KOG nailed it on the head and was the first thing I thought of when this question popped up in my head: Obviously Bail Organa and his wife showed Leia holo-vids of her mother when she was a child. She would probably only remember her mother being very beautiful. As for the "Sad" comment, a lot of fans think Leia picked up on those feelings through her connection with The Force and that particular impression stayed with her in association with the memory of her mother....
And I don't really like how he doesn't bother thinking about something coherent to place an action scene. At the beginning, in the space fight scene, they break the spaceship window, and 5 seconds later it's already part of history, as if nothing happened, then they land a half space ship that just passed through atmosphere, with no wings nor thruster to pilote it, and they land right on the landing zone... :roll:
Hey. Their Jedi. Obi-Wan lept out of a 300 some-odd story window to grab onto a fleeing droid. Anakin lept out of a Speeder to intercept another Speeder going god-knows-how-fast at a significant altitude. What if he missed? These guys do the impossible and cheat death routinely.

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Post by Tachyon » Sat Jun 04, 2005 5:54 pm

Basically, the Sith were at one time nearly as plentiful as the Jedi...
Now a lot of stuff makes sense. Why wasn't this info in the movie!? It should have been.
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finally see the movie

Post by 2000YearsOldMan » Mon Jun 06, 2005 8:04 pm

I fianlly see the movie.
Then after I saw the movie I can't think anything, my brain was busying annolyzing the information I got from the movie.
I think George he really did good job on the endding of the movie,(from anakin turn to dark side, to the end) then the begining and middle part are the trash.
But I still stunned by the special effects in the movie, they are just so awesome. Over all I think this movie will be great, if George didn't people in there(except lord Vader) :|
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