Heldensagen vom Kosmosinsel *cough*

Other mecha manga, shows, OAV's & movies

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Falk
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Heldensagen vom Kosmosinsel *cough*

Post by Falk » Wed Jun 21, 2006 4:28 pm

Any info about that serie/whatever ?

It has some of the best spaceship designs I've ever seen (some sort of space Ferrari), but there's almost no info on it. In fact it's a bit like FSS, it's a space opera story with apparently lot of characters, started yeaaaaars ago, but never translated to english and with almost no info.

All I know is that it's based on some books, not manga, then later some manga and anime (OAV I think) were made.
The charac design looks a bit old-school, but the spaceship design is awe - some. I wonder if there's an artbook (there's some with photos but they must have drawn them XD.
There are some small pictures on HLJ :
http://www.hlj.com/hljlist2/?Dis=2&from ... eldensagen
Look at Brunhild, Barbarossa, Parcivale...
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Post by Tachyon » Wed Jun 21, 2006 5:42 pm

You, my friend, have stumbled upon the Legend of Galactic Heroes. Studio Nue did the ship designs. I have some in a Studio Nue Entertainment Bible but not a complete set.

It started as a set of novels that were popular with female readers in Japan. From there it was animated (I believe it was either a movie or an OAV series). I tried to watch some of the anime at a small convention years ago but there were no subtitles and it was a little boring (lots of flashbacks where women were hurting each others' feelings).

I bought a Legend of Galactic Heroes art book a few years back hoping it would have ship designs but all I got were character designs. The ship designs are really cool but hard to find. If someone can point me to an artbook for the ships I'd buy it.
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Post by Engage » Wed Jun 21, 2006 6:50 pm

Legend of Galactic Heroes ran on television for about 110 episodes if I remember correctly plus 2 movies and a 45 episode OVA prequel named "Gaiden". Copies of the bootleg DVD TV series box sets appear occasionally on Ebay but they will run you about $100 (USD) for all 13 discs.

In Japan they had a website that would sell a "subscription" for almost everything that had to do with the show, the only thing that wasn't included in the subscription were the books. Once a month, a DVD would show up at your house and this process took a while because there were 45 discs. This ended in 2002.

There was a plan to liscense the show here in the US in 2000 but I'm not sure if that was successful or not.

I did find a Legends of Galactic Heroes book on Ebay, I was thinking on bidding on it. I'm not sure if it's just character designs or not but I thought I'd share it with you guys anyway.

Heres the link:

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Post by Falk » Wed Jun 21, 2006 7:49 pm

Tachyon wrote:I bought a Legend of Galactic Heroes art book a few years back hoping it would have ship designs but all I got were character designs.
Héhé, that what I feared :P I've watched the first OAV I think, with no subtitles either, and it looked for like a cheesy TV serie with "intricate" stories between characters than a space opera :roll: . With just a few seconds of spaceships from time to time :(
It feel kinda "shojo-esque", they talk, they talk more, and nothing really happens.

Those ships deserve a great artbook, but the only reesults on HLJ are those 4 books :
http://www.hlj.com/product/TOK023 (Engage, I fear this one is the one Tachyon has^^)
http://www.hlj.com/product/ALBBK-01
http://www.hlj.com/product/ALBBK-02
http://www.hlj.com/product/TOK60961
and the other look to be mostly made of kit picture than awesome artwork :(
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Post by Newton » Thu Jun 22, 2006 8:57 pm

Man, Falk, I love ya, but you got no clue what you're talking about! LoGH is one of the best, most involved space opera series I've ever come across.

A good portion of the series is available via BitTorrent. Go to Tokyo Toshokan (www.tokyotosho.net) and find the series. The subbers have got up to at least episode 76, and I do believe the movies and OVAs are available as well.

Definitely score the first movie. It's a work of art! And it's not a shoujo storyline at all. It's a mature storyline about heroes, history and what happens when people choose not to play out the "hero cycle".

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Post by Falk » Sun Jun 25, 2006 12:37 am

Héhé, ok, I'll check it out then. I would've miss Blame! (my all time fav' manga along FSS) if I hadn't had a second chance to read it...

Thanks for the info, the torrent is slow, but working^^.

Is there an order to watch it ? Movie, then serie, then another movie, somethign like that ?
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Post by Falk » Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:04 pm

Ahoy^^

I started to watch the anime (BTW, for anyone who wants to see it, there's now a big 25Gb/110 episodes torrent, on tokyotosho I guess, or try mininova if you can't find it on tokyotosho), well it's cool, though a bit rushed for now.

Well the "strategies" deployed in the first 2 episodes are quite simple, almost stupid. Having 60K spaceships but splitting them in 3 smaller forces to far away from each other is really stupid. I'm maybe picky, but this really broke the mmh... "epicness" ? of such large battles.

Also for now I don't really like how the ships are destroyed. Most of those spaceships are about 1km long, but still many of them are destroyed in just a few seconds. When you think about WWII ships like Bismark, Tirpitz or Yamato, they would not sink before several hours under really heavy fire.

And I don't really like the command board of the ships, on either side. Something more like the NERV HQ would've been better. In the empire ships they seem to be on a throne in each spaceship and with almost no navigators, in the federation ships it's really dull and simple.

But it's only the beginning and it's a relatively old serie, so I'll keep watching and see how it evolves^^.
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Post by Falk » Thu Jul 20, 2006 9:50 pm

Well, I'm liking it.
Has anyone seen it, except Newton ?
Cuz' in this period of FSS starvation, it's a great placeholder. And with 110 episodes (up to 150 with side stories, +2 or 3 movies) you're in for some time.

The beginning was a bit rushed (particularly the space battles, nowadays they would benefit a lot from CG, but back in 88, they must have had a hard time animating perspective of such vessels), but at episode 15 there's a more serious/detailed battle and the characters are getting deeper (and there's more spaceship !).
I particularly like Yang's character, and Kircheis who seems to be a bit his equivalent in the empire.

Tachyon, I think you should really give it another try (with subtitles this time^^), and anyone else^^.
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Post by Newton » Fri Jul 21, 2006 5:27 pm

Falk:

I'm really glad you like the show. I've been preaching on the soapbox of LoGH for quite some time now, and I'm always trying to get more people to try it.

Getting Legend of the Galactic Heroes out of Japan is a battle in progress. The fansubs are there because it was projected that an official subtitled release would have been on the order of nearly 2000 US$ per box set - and that was back in 2001. But I digress...

I'm also glad you like the characters. Yang and Kircheis are two of my favorite characters as well. They put a human face on what otherwise would be a ridiculously huge war.

For anybody here at Gears, I would strongly suggest giving Legend of the Galactic Heroes a try. For those who have seen an ep or two and didn't like it, please try again. If you're a Gundam fan, there is a lot to like about LoGH - not the least of which are the badass starship designs...^_^

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Post by superdupont » Sun Jul 23, 2006 7:39 pm

Héhé ;) , LoGH... I bought a bootleg dvd set on ebay some time ago, watched maybe two (or three ?) seasons in a short time, then gave up. The edition I have (Korean ? Chinese ?) has very poor subs, as a matter of fact if you don't know what the topic is they can be quite misleading sometimes.

I disagree with you Falk, on the point that ships explode too quickly : after all they're in space so a depressurization may have faster effects than a hit for a "floating" ship, I think it might be better to make a comparizon with planes, if we keep the WWII example then think about the heavy bombers that could disappear in a cloud after a direct flak hit. Then again, the "death" of spaceships is something that is difficult to show, since they cannot sink / fall like objects in the sea / atmosphere. A quick explosion seems to be the most common representation, regardless of the anime. On the other hand, movies like Starship Troopers offer a more elaborate vision. Any spacewarfare scholar out there ?

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Post by kosh » Tue Jul 25, 2006 12:09 am

Quick explosions are the rule in most anime sci-fi starship explosions. Look at SDF:Macross, the Zentran ships are huge but within just 30 seconds at most after a Dadelus attack, they're a fireball. In live action sci-fi they're just as fast; Star Trek, Babylon 5, Stargate Atlantis, etc. The major exception are the ships in Star Wars, they go up pretty slowly, but that's probably due to thier enormous size; one class of Star Destroyer was something like 1000 kilometers long ( I think, I'm not a big fan of SW.). At any rate, I would say that the reason they go up fast is due to explosive decompression ripping the hull apart, not so much the explosion itself because aside from the reactors/power source and any missiles/torpedoes on board, the fire in the hull would extinguish once hard vacum was reached.
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Post by Falk » Wed Jul 26, 2006 12:04 am

Mmh, yup', quick explosions may make sens, it's hard to imagine without someone who has knowledge on the question. But it's not cool :P
That's what it implies that bothers me. Those spaceships are about 1km long, so there may be at least as much guys on board as on WWII ships (3000 for the Yamato I think), if not more, the ship can take some hits for a while thanks to its force fields (you can see it in the serie from time to time) then one laser goes trhough (or a physical weapon, like a missile) and BOOM, the whole ship, maybe pretty old with hundreds of victories is destroyed, half of the crew dies instantly and the other half will suffocate and choke in the following seconds.
Ok it's war and war is ugly, but the anime lacks head to head battles and a bit of... mmh... tension ? that would come with it. Well when a character dies in battle, you don't really see it coming. Maybe they were outnumbered or something, but their spaceship was in good shape, then the next seconds it's disintegrated... Oh well...

(Off-topic: Kosh, I don't think Star Wars ships are that huge^^. A standard Star Destoyer is 1600m long, a Super Star Destroyer (well the only one tht existed in the movies is the Executor) is about 19km (a few bigger ships may exist in the comics). Look at this site that was posted in the FSS talk section for a lot of spaceship size comparision : http://www.merzo.net/ )

Superdupont: You gave up because of the bad subs ? Or got bored ?
Yup' the subs are not perfect (the timing is sometimes quite off), but it's waaaaay better than nothing^^.

SPOILER: it makes my post faster, oh wait no, I mean DON'T READ IF YOU'VE NOT SEEN THE 1st SEASON

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Ha crap, Kircheis is dead :( . Not that I didn't see it coming (cuz' he's not that much in the ending of first season^^, and a guy clearly says that good guys don't live long), but I expected it at least a bit later.
And now what'll happen to the Barbarossa ? I've browsed a few japanese sites, and it looks like the ship won't move that much, if at all. There is no variant with the new reich emblem amongst the small spaceship toy collection, contrary to the Brünhild and other flagships.
It'll stay docked in the Odin's HQ forever ? Meeeh, Brünhild and König's Tiger are great, but Barbarossa was the best design...
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superdupont

Post by superdupont » Wed Jul 26, 2006 8:10 am

I gave up because I got bored, well the poor subtitles had something to do with that - if you're watching episodes that you've downloaded the subtitles must be better, I bought the bootleg set because it seemed easier than to d/l all episodes (at the time all were not available) but those damn subs look like they've been made by college students that didn't know they were talking of space warfare...
Plus, I must admitt the stragne Japanese fascination for German things got me disturbed at that time.
That said, I'm curious to see what events will unfold so I'll get back at the series one day.

spoiler, too

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After Kircheis's death the Barbarossa doesn't appear at all in the seasons I've watched so far, it seems every "big" ship boss has his flagship made for him that reflects his personality - hence the "twin towers" have pretty much the same ship, Kircheis the daring red-haired man has a pointed red ship, Reinhard has one that stands out, the Königstiger is fast and has a "captain" that thinks fast (too fast), and so on. So, my point is that a flagship cannot be used by someone else than the one it was designed for !
I'd say my favorite one is the Brûnhild and I've grown lo appreciate the Hyperion, though at first sight I thought it was a pretty boring design.
[/b]

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Post by kosh » Thu Jul 27, 2006 2:39 pm

You're right Falk, I screwed the pooch on that size for the stardestroyers. I misread the length, it should have been in meters, not kilometers. But the bloody thing is still huge and IIRC, in the comics and other books, there are a couple of classes larger than the Executer.
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Post by superdupont » Mon Aug 07, 2006 9:13 pm

Thinking about space battles... From the comments I read here and there Yamato 2520 had great space combat sequences, has anybody seen this one ? It's impossible to find !

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